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From The Sunday Times

April 27, 2008

It’s just a game, says man behind Grand Theft Auto

Mark Macaskill finds the man behind Grand Theft Auto unrepentant

Its output has been described as “sick, deluded and beneath contempt” and banned for its “casual sadism”. Now the head of the company that designed Grand Theft Auto, the video game in which players kill policemen, take part in drug deals and visit prostitutes, has condemned his critics as the same kind of people who complained about Elvis Presley gyrating his hips in the 1950s.

In his first newspaper interview, Leslie Benzies, 37, president of the Edinburgh-based gaming company Rockstar North, says its games are victims of the same misplaced moral panic that greeted rock’n’roll.

Grand Theft Auto IV, the latest instalment in the computer game franchise, which has sold more than 70m copies, is due to be released on Tuesday and is expected to take £200m world-wide in its first week. It will have an 18 certificate.

Rockstar’s games have frequently provoked controversy.

One game was withdrawn across America after it emerged that it contained hidden sex scenes. The case prompted Hillary Clinton to call on the Federal Trade Commission to investigate. She criticised Rockstar for “stealing the innocence of our children and making the difficult job of being a parent even harder”.

The first Grand Theft Auto, released a decade ago, was branded as “sick, deluded and beneath contempt” by the Police Federation. Last year the British Board of Film Classification refused to certify the Rockstar game Manhunt 2 because of its “casual sadism” and “unrelenting focus on stalking and brutal slaying”.

High street retailers including Dixons, Currys and PC World banned the original Manhunt after it was linked to the murder in 2004 of Stefan Pakeerah, 14, from Leicester, who was beaten with a claw hammer and stabbed repeatedly. His parents blamed the murder on the game; the killer was a frequent player.

Commenting on the Manhunt furore, Benzies said: “We wanted to make a horror game that would scare you in the same way a film would.

“It doesn’t seem to me to be any worse than a film. If it’s a film or a book, you can do what you want. We seem to be in a different category.”

However, Benzies claims that some of those who criticise his games are unnerved by progress. “There is a big fear factor here. It’s the coming of the railways, it’s Elvis shaking his hips. It’s cars going over 25 miles per hour and making people explode,” he said.

“We’ve had such a beating over the past three years. If I get into a confrontation about it, once I’ve had my beating, I ask if they’ve ever played the game. Invariably they haven’t.”

Benzies said that he was mindful of the game’s 18 certificate and would not allow his children to play it, adding: “We’re very careful about who we market the game to and what is in the game.”

Grand Theft Auto IV is highly realistic and violent. Players control Niko Bellic, an illegal eastern European immigrant who arrives in Liberty City, a pastiche of New York, and is sucked into the criminal underworld.

Gamers then explore the virtual landscape and engage in drug deals, hijackings and gang warfare. They can execute passers-by, have sex with prostitutes and goad the police into high-speed chases. Weapons on offer include Uzi 9mm sub-machineguns, shotguns, hand grenades, knives and baseball bats.

The anticipated success of Grand Theft Auto IV comes as one of Britain’s most prominent neuroscientists warns that children who spend hours playing computer games could risk doing so much damage to their brains that they lose their personalities.

Baroness Greenfield, director of the Royal Institution, claims the rush of continually winning and losing at the games produces “hits” of dopamine, the euphoria-inducing chemical that has been linked to drug dependency. The long-term result, she suggests in an interview in today’s Sunday Times Magazine, could be damage to a part of the brain that is key to forming personality. The excessive dopamine, according to Greenfield, may “reduce activation in the prefrontal cortex and, in so doing, tip the balance away from awareness of the significance, the meaning of our actions”.

The scientist warns: “Individuality could be obliterated in favour of a passive state, reacting to a flood of incoming sensations – a ‘yuck’ and ‘wow’ mentality.”

Greenfield elaborates her theories in ID: The Quest for Identity in the 21st Century, to be published next month.

Stafford Lightman, professor of medicine at Bristol University and a leading neuroscientist, said: “It may well be there are children who become more susceptible to the influence of the big kick they get from winning on a computer game.”

He said there was “no evidence at all” for Greenfield’s theory about the longer-term personality effect.

Additional reporting: Roger Waite

Goodfellas, brilliant film, extremely violent, drugs heavily involved, sex. Its an 18 because of that, and its brilliant film. GTA does similar things and its slated for destroying our childrens minds when its clearly aimed 18 and above's. If

Parents need to do some parenting once in a while,

William Hartley, wakefield, United Kingdom

I want entertainment variety and i'm willing to pay for it. Role on GTA5.

Ron, Penrith , Cumbria

The game is for adults, with an 18 certificate.
What does research on video games affecting CHILDREN have to do with a game aimed at people who are ADULTS?

Also, Stefan Pakeerah had a copy of manhunt, the killer did not, and the police denied Manhunt was related to the murder.

Thanks for the bias.

Luke, Nottingham, UK

The best part of this is the people that claim GTA to be the spawn of Satan have never actually played these games, it smacks of bandwagon jumping, hypocritical sensasionalism from a few pathetic "experts" who want their 5 minutes of fame. They should stop trying to interfere in other people's lives

Andrew, London,

As soon as I get GTA IV I will immediately be overcome with the desire to destroy everything and everyone, and subsequently myself.

Constant reminders of Climate Change, being told what to eat, the cost of petrol, eco tax, the ousting of smokers and other everyday 'issues' only make me happier

Mike Deathray, Manchester, England

I'm sick of "scientists" and "researchers" who bag on this game saying the violence corrupts our youth. Most of the critics haven't even played GTA, too! Also, where are the people complaining about violent films and other forms of entertainment? Heck, if you don't like violence go protest real war

John, Opeth, US

Way to misrepresent the game and the issues attached to it. Adults need to stop typecasting all gamers as screwed up misfits, addicts, and criminals. It is the responsibility of parents to raise their children and teach them about the realities of death, violence, sex, etc., not a fictional game.

Zane, Chicago, USA

Grand Theft Auto IV - Another indication that western civilization is in decline. When completely immoral and illegal acts are glorified and made to be entertainment, instead of rejected by the consuming public, we know that our once great western society is decaying. You people are sick!

rockn, Somerset, USA

The people who will be queueing up for their copy of GTA at midnight will bear no resemblance to those who hang around on street corners causing trouble and provoking violence. Out of all the people who buy this game how many do you think will kill somebody? Not enough to tie the blame on this game.

Gary, Nottingham, United Kingdom

I'm 15 years old. I have been playing GTA series since i was 9 with my older brother who at the time was nearly 20. We played GTA3 and bonded alot. Its been 6 years since i have play my first GTA and im a great student and in honors classes. I play mostly mature games. Its just a game.

Andrei Shubin, Nyack, United States

To say one "takes part" is a laughable analogy; video games are simply a story telling medium which, like books and movies, often call upon disagreeable motifs to evoke catharsis. Many respected artists were once vilified in the same manner only to win high praise in later generations.

Erik, Rockford, United States

wait are we missing something here...everyone goes on about films. But in films you don't take part , you do in games. The moral conduct of film characters is not the responsibility of the viewer. In games you are put into that position, further more you are rewarded for doing the complete opposite

victor Martinez, london, uk

The scientist responsible for the garbage regarding "forming personality" can be discounted. Most of the older gaming generation are in our 30's or older, we know its scaremongering nonsense. Infact most of the concerns surrounding this game can be summed up with 2 words "responsible parenting".

Silver Fox, London,

They say it for adults but me and all my friends are getting it and we are 13 year old. we just ask are parents who have no idea about the game and they buy it for us.i cannot belive that people think that because we shot and kill police officer in the game that we will do it in real life.

Lewis, Edinburgh , United Kingdom

I have always been interested in watching violence on TV or playing violent PC games . Always curious to absorb my senses in that "other world", as a form of escapism. Never had a fight in my life. I am a 37 year old primary school teacher and I have no problem with over 18s playing these games.

tommy rok, bristol, england

This game is made for ADULTS not children I don't know how often this needs to be said.

Gaming is not just for kids and the reason the likes of Clinton et all don't realise this is because this is the first generation of adults to be exposed to games as evolved as the likes of GTA4.

paul rayment, leeds,

Times morphing into the Mail?
Why are films like Goodfellas praised as art whilst video games are seen as catalyst to violent behaviour?
Because the 'experts' don't understand it, I bet the people criticising have not played a minute of the game.

Owen, Cardiff,

So we have movies such as SAW, Scream and Freddy vs Jason... but the bad parents sit back and complain about this. Let me tell you, that if you critisize this game, you dont deserve to be a parent. This game is made for adults, not for kids. If they get their hands on a copy it is YOUR FAULT.

Grant, London, UK

It is just a game, you see stuff like this in movies and on tv so what makes them any different? Its far easier for someone under 18 to turn on thier tv and watch something like this or download it than buy the game.

Aaron, oxford,

The quote from Clinton and the 'supposed' scientific studies from those professors brought tears to my eyes, hilarity ensued.

I wish it were politically incorrect to denigrate the gaming industry in the media, perhaps then we'd get two sides to the argument, as opposed to these reams of hogwash.

Farore, Melbourne, Australia

Stefan Pakeerah who was murdered was the owner of the game Manhunt and it was found in their room, the killer did not own a copy, nor was it ever proved that he had played it.

Mark, Bristol, England

Obviously before computer games, nobody killed, maimed or burgled...obviously!!!!!

People that look to computer games as a scapegoat need a reality check. It's the same kind that blame music and lyrics on a persons actions.

Rob Lewis, Norfolk, UK

It wouldnt be so bad if only the 18+ played these games but unfortunately more and more parents are allowing children as young as 5 to play these games. There is nothing being done to these parents and so the blame falls onto the people that created the game in the first place.

Julie, Essex,

Children are innocents and why rush to take that away? They use to see police as good people not evil. What on earth are we teaching them?
As adults we know the difference between right and wrong, im not sure that a young child fully understands and these games are not helping them learn either

Julie, Essex,

i think ive played every grand theft auto game, and as far as i know ive never commited a crime portrayed in the game in real life( or any other crime)
how come, games like pro evolution soccer are blamed for kids not playing outside, and then violent games are blamed for murders!?
hypocrisy

will, grimsby, england

I definately agree with Phill's post about the fact that a person must already be inclined to commit crimes. Perhaps playing a game such as GTA may give them some "inspiration", but I cannot and will not believe that violent games drive normal people to commit violent crime.

Dan, Leeds, UK

Ok...a kid who killed another kid was a frequent game where he could kill people......hmmm, killers like to play games where they kill people? Shocking. I guess if we ban these games people with violent tendencies will go away! I hear before they even invented electricity that violence was nill...

Snall, New York,

Like anything designed for entertainment, this game will do no harm in moderation. Quite why it is slated so much is hard to say. I for one am eagerly anticipating the arrival of my pre-ordered copy, but still lead a balanced, healthy, productive and non violent life as a postgraduate law student!

Ben A, Manchester, UK

My kids have grown up on a diet of violent games, as I did. I dont believe a game will make a person go out and break the law, I believe you already have to be that way inclined in the first place.
Never been in trouble with the police and certainly not unhinged in any way.

Phill, The Wirral, England